Maximo in Hermas Visions II:3,4 - bibliography after Athous and before Sinaiticus

Steven Avery

Steven Avery

Administrator
Note: Anger-Dindorf differs from Athos - why?

Document the Greek non-Max text from Anger-Dindorf, Memnon etc.

Anger-Dindorf 1856
Έρείς δέ: ιδού θλίψις έρχεται μεγάλη σφόδρα και εί δοκεί σοι, * αποστράφηθι της αμαρτίας και επιστρεψον αυθις πρός κύριος πνεύ-
Also

1887 Hilgenfeld Prolegomena
https://books.google.com/books?id=71k-AQAAMAAJ&pg=PR19
p. xix-xx
1674074310151.png

1674074335954.png

https://books.google.com/books?id=71k-AQAAMAAJ&pg=PA13
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see xix, xx, 13

Check Memnon
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Athos Grigoriou 96

Facsimiles of the Athos Fragments of the Shepherd of Hermas. Photographed and transcribed by Kirsopp Lake (1907)
This PDF can give bigger pics
https://ia600604.us.archive.org/4/items/facsimilesofatho00herm/facsimilesofatho00herm.pdf
https://books.google.com/books?id=RbIVAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA2
first, second, third, fourth, seventh, and eighth leaves of the original MS., are still preserved in the library of the monastery of St Gregory (Mt. Athos)
https://books.google.com/books?id=RbIVAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA5
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https://books.google.com/books?id=RbIVAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA5

VIS. II. 3. 2 — VIS. III. 5. 5 [καὶ πορευομ]ένους ἐν ἀκακίᾳ καὶ ἁπλότητι. οὗτοι κατισχύσουσι πάσης πονηρίας καὶ παραμενοῦσιν εἰς ζωὴν αἰώνιον. 3. μακάριοι πάντες οἱ ἐργαζόμενοι τὴν δικαιοσύνην. [οὐ] διαφθαρήσονται ἕως αἰῶνος. 4. ἐρεῖς δὲ Μαξίμῳ· Ἰδοὺ θλίψις ἔρχεται· ἐάν σοι φανῇ πάλιν ἀρνῆσαι, ἐγγὺς κύριος τοῖς ἐπιστρεφομένοις, ὡς γέγραπται ἐν τῷ ̓Ελὰδ καὶ Μωδάδ,

1674049019228.png


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Hermae pastor: Graece primum ediderunt et interpretationem veterum latinam
Anger & Dindorf - (1855-56)
Simonides
https://books.google.com/books?id=QEVMAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA9
1673986689215.png

μνησικακία θάνατον κατεργάζεται. Συ δε, Ερμά, μεγάλας θλίψεις έσχες ιδιωτικάς διά τας μεν παραβάσεις του οίκου σου, ότι ουκ έμέλησέ σοι περί αυτών, αλλά παρενεθυμήθης, και ταις πραγματείαις σου συνανεφύρης ταϊς πονηραϊς. Αλλά σώζει σε τό μη απο- 5 στήναι από του θεού του ζώντος, και η απλότης σου και η έγκράτεια, ταύτα σέσωκέ σε, ει παραμένεις τούτοις· έασoν εκείνας και πάντας σώζει τους τα τοιαύτα εργαζομένους. "Οσοι δε έν ακακία και απλότητι διάγουσι τον βίον, ούτοι κατισχύσουσι πάσης πονηρίας 10 και παραμενούσιν εις ζωήν αιώνιον. Μακάριοι πάντες οι εργαζόμενοι την δικαιοσύνην· ούτοι γάρ μόνοι φθορά ουχ υπόκεινται. Έρείς δέ: ιδού θλίψις έρχεται μεγάλη σφόδρα και εί δοκεί σοι, * αποστράφηθι της αμαρτίας και επιστρεψον αυθις πρός κύριος πνεύ- 15 ματι ταπεινώσεως εγγύς ο κύριος τοίς επιστρεφομένοις, ως γέγραπται εν οίς ελάλησε το πνεύμα κυρίου Μωσεϊ δι Ελδάδ και Μωδάδ τοίς προφητεύσασιν εν τη ερήμω το λαό.»


Funk has Maximo and gives this apparatus
https://books.google.com/books?id=PxAaAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA414
https://books.google.com/books?id=PxAaAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA428
1674049901845.png

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Hermae Pastor Graece ex fragmentis Lipsiensibus (1856)
Tischendorf update to SImonides

https://books.google.com/books?id=9I4wAQAAMAAJ&pg=PR15
1673986889439.png

Plus etiam, si fieri potest, alter locus valet. Vis. II, 3. Graece scriptum est: Ερεῖς δὲ Μαξίμῳ Ἰδοὺ θλίψις ἔρχεται. At quid tandem Maximus iste sibi vult, quum per totum librum nulli Maximo locus sit? Quid rei esset, non latuisse videtur Simonidem, vel potius doctum Simonidis adiutorem Lipsiensem: eorum enim opera repositum atque post etiam editum est: Ερεῖς δέ· ἰδοὺ θλίψις ἔρKetαι μɛɣáin ópódoa, quo cognito ad „Maximum" explicandum non opus est Oedipo. Vulgatus textus Latinus habet: „Dices autem: Ecce magna (Vat. cod. Magna ecce) tribulatio venit." Inde quae Graecae lectioni lux affulget, paullo curiosius inquirenti iam satis erit. Ne tamen quicquam ad explanandam rem et ad persuadendum ipsis incredulis nobis desit, Pal. codex id quod iam ante hos duo fere menses cum R. Anger viro doctissimo communicavi non modo ,,Maxima ecce“ praebet, sed ipsum vitium Graeci textus, teste Alberto Dressel, accuratissime praeit hunc in modum: „Dicis autem maximo. Ecce tribulatio supervenit."


I will add, if possible, that the second place is worth it. Visions 2, 3. (=Hermas 7.4) It is written in Greek: '(Greek 6 words + English translation-) from CSP: εριϲ δε μαξιμω ε̣ι δου θλιψειϲ ερχε ται'. But in the end, what does Maximus want for himself, since throughout the whole book there is no room for Maximus? It seems that Simonides, or rather the learned assistant of Simonides from Leipzig, did not hide what was the matter (Greek 7 word plus translation): for their work was stored and published afterwards: : Behold a great (Vat. cod. Behold great) tribulation is coming." From this, the light that will shine on the Greek lesson, will be enough for a little more curious inquirer. However, let us not lack anything to explain the matter and to convince the unbelievers themselves, Pal. The codex - that which I already shared with R. Anger, a very learned man, almost two months ago - not only provides "Behold the greatest", but the very defect of the Greek text, as witnessed by Alberto Dressel, very accurately points out in this way: "But you say to the greatest. Behold, trouble has come."

The iota subscript underneat the omega ω makes it the dative case makes it "Hermas to Maximo" on μαξιμω


https://books.google.com/books?id=9I4wAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA5
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III. ,Σὺ δέ, Ἑρμᾶ, μηκέτι μνησικάκει τοῖς τέκνοις σου, μηδὲ τὴν ἀδελφήν σου ἐάσῃς, ἵνα καθαρισθῶσιν ἀπὸ τῶν προτέρων ἁμαρτιῶν αὐτῶν· παιδευθήσονται γὰρ παιδείαν δικαίαν, ἐὰν σὺ μὴ μνησικακή. σῃς αὐτοῖς· μνησικακία θάνατον κατεργάζεται. Σὺ δέ, Ἑρμᾶ, μεγάλας θλίψεις ἔσχες ἰδιωτικὰς διὰ τὰς μὲν παραβάσεις τοῦ οἴκου σου, ὅτι οὐκ ἐμέλησέ σοι περὶ αὐτῶν, ἀλλὰ παρενεθυμήθης καὶ ταῖς πραγματίαις' σου συνανεφύρης ταῖς πονηραῖς. ̓Αλλὰ σώζει σε τὸ μὴ ἀποστῆναι ἀπὸ τοῦ θεοῦ τοῦ ζῶντος, καὶ ἡ ἁπλότητά σου καὶ ἡ ἐγκράτεια, ταῦτα σέσωκέ σε, ἐὰν ἐμμείνῃς, καὶ πάντας σώζει τοὺς τὰ τοιαῦτα ἐργαζομένους. Ὅσοι δὲ ἐν ἀκακίᾳ καὶ ἁπλότητι, οὗτοι κατισχύσουσι πάσης πονηρίας καὶ παραμένουσιν εἰς ζωὴν αἰώνιον. Μακάριοι πάντες οἱ ἐργαζόμενοι τὴν δικαιοσύνην· ἀδιάφθαρτον ἔχουσιν ἕως αἰῶνος. Ἐρεῖς δὲ Μαξίμῳ Ἰδοὺ θλίψις ἔρχεται· ἐάν σοι φανῇ; πάλιν ἐγγὺς κύριος τοῖς ἐπιστρεφομένοις, γέγραπται ἐν τῷ Ελδὰδ καὶ Μωδὴδ' τοῖς προφητεύσασιν ἐν τῇ ἐρήμῳ τῷ λαῷ.

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Memnon: archäologische Monatsschrift - Simonides 1857 includes Hermas columns
https://www.purebibleforum.com/inde...-simonides-1857-includes-hermas-columns.2939/
https://books.google.com/books?id=Rh9BAAAAcAAJ&pg=PT12

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Godgeleerde en wijsgeerige opstellen - p. 047-062 - review of Tischendorf 1857 Hermas accusation
Allard Pierson
https://books.google.com/books?id=Nw4EAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA56

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Patrum Apostolicorum Opera (1857) - might have maximo
Dressel - Tischendorf section ends on p. 55
https://books.google.com/books?id=ggib8P8vzXIC&pg=PR54

https://books.google.com/books?id=5AdyYVZXS40C&pg=PR54

same as
Hermae Pastor Graece ex fragmentis Lipsiensibus (1856)
Tischendorf update to SImonides

And remains in 1863 even after Sinaiticus
https://books.google.com/books?id=_xpWAAAAMAAJ&pg=PR54

search "εριϲ δε μαξιμω ε̣ι"
Maximo text from Tischendorf of Sinaiticus
1860
https://books.google.com/books?id=DpI4EOWye7MC&pg=RA8-PA143
1863
https://books.google.com/books?id=LBqHZmhzLgwC&pg=RA3-PA143

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Leipziger repertorium der deutschen und ausländischen literatur (1858)
Dressel
https://books.google.com/books?id=vnADAAAAYAAJ&pg=RA1-PA73

Shows Vulgata and Palatine with note.


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Jallabert (1858)
https://books.google.com/books?id=sLJWAAAAcAAJ&pg=PA113
p. 113 118-19-20

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Donaldson
 
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Steven Avery

Steven Avery

Administrator
Pure Bible Forum

Maximo in Hermas Visions II:3,4 - from Tischendorf to James Donaldson to David Daniels
https://www.purebibleforum.com/inde...orf-to-james-donaldson-to-david-daniels.2851/

Maximo in Hermas Visions II:3,4 - bibliography after Athous and before Sinaiticus
https://www.purebibleforum.com/inde...aphy-after-athous-and-before-sinaiticus.2942/

Simonides Hermas 1855-56, 1857 Lipsiensis, 1859
https://www.purebibleforum.com/index.php?threads/simonides-hermas-1855-56-1857-lipsiensis-1859.2788/

Tischendorf 1860 Hermas retraction - Notitia editionis codicis Bibliorum Sinaitic
https://www.purebibleforum.com/inde...tia-editionis-codicis-bibliorum-sinaitici.93/

the Simonides and Tischendorf Hermas editions in the 1850s
https://www.purebibleforum.com/inde...tischendorf-hermas-editions-in-the-1850s.851/

Notes on Simonides publication lists - 1853 Hermas - Canfora Artemidorus - Matthew portrait -
https://www.purebibleforum.com/index.php?threads/notes-on-simonides-publication-lists.599/

Alexander Lykourgos and Simonides, 1855 correspondence about the CFA pages in Leipzig
https://www.purebibleforum.com/inde...spondence-about-the-cfa-pages-in-leipzig.845/

Hermas - Visions - Commandments - Mandates - sections in 1859 Simoneidos, and New Finds
https://www.purebibleforum.com/inde...ections-in-1859-simoneidos-and-new-finds.759/
 
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Steven Avery

Steven Avery

Administrator
[Message to Maximus, an apostate, regarding the coming persecution. The Lord is near those who turn to him.]
A History of Penance: Being a Study of the Authorities
(A) For the Whole Church to A.D. 450
(B) For the Western Church from A.D. 450 to A.D. 1215
Oscar Daniel Watkins
https://books.google.com/books?id=f_XYAAAAMAAJ&pg=PA29

Why does this add commentary from the Greek.
There is no “an apostate.”
 
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Steven Avery

Steven Avery

Administrator
Memnon
https://books.google.com/books?id=Rh9BAAAAcAAJ&pg=PT11

https://forums.carm.org/threads/cod...-simonides-timeline.13239/page-5#post-1044841


Ἰδοὺ οὖν ὅτι οὕτως ἔχει τὰ παλαίτερα ρόν ·
καὶ γὰρ ἐν ̓́Αθῳ οὐδὲν ὑπάρχει, καθὰ καὶ προεἶπον, χειρόγραφον τι τῆς Λατινίδος φωνῆς, ἀλλ' οὐδὲ ὑπῆρξε πώποτε. Δι' ὃ καὶ δύναμαι εἰπεῖν μετὰ πεποιθήσεως μᾶλλον ἐκ τοιούτου, ὡς ἔοικεν, Ἑλληνικοῦ ἐσφαλμένου χειρογράφου προέκυψεν ἡ Λατινικὴ μετάφρασις. Μετὰ δὲ ταῦτα ὀρθοτέρου χειρογράφου εὑρεθέντος ἐδιορθοῦτο τὰ ἐσφαλμένα τῆς Λατινίδος μεταφράσεως χωρία
 
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Steven Avery

Steven Avery

Administrator
1856 - Journal matches Anger-Dindorf Text.
Dindorf
Leipziger repertorium der deutschen und ausländischen literatur: Ier-cviier jahrgang, Volumes 55-56
https://books.google.com/books?id=xGwDAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA132
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Noch schlimmer ist es den bald folgenden Worten p. 9, 13. ergangen, die in der ersten Abschrift lauten (Greek) stalt deren in der zweiten Abschrift gesetzt ist (Greek) was natürlich weit entfernt ist die Worte des Hermas zu treffen, wie sich in den Anmerkungen zur Lateinischen Uebersetzung zeigen wird.

It is even worse for the words p. 9, 13., which read (Greek-speak to Maximo) in the first copy instead of (Greek-great tribulation) which is set in the second copy, which of course is far from matching the words of Hermas, as the notes to the Latin translation show will show.
 
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Steven Avery

Steven Avery

Administrator
It is strange that much of what Tischendorf wrote about Maximus and retraction = authenticity is the same in 1856 and 1873, with opposite positions.

1856
https://books.google.com/books?id=9I4wAQAAMAAJ&pg=PR15
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1857
https://books.google.com/books?id=5AdyYVZXS40C&pg=PR54
https://archive.org/details/patrumapostolic02fathgoog/page/n59/mode/2up
https://archive.org/details/MN40294ucmf_1/page/n60/mode/2up

1863
https://books.google.com/books?id=lioVAAAAQAAJ&pg=PR54

Quod vix dubito quin Graecus codex cum tot aliis e Latino
 
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